Australian Stadiums Discussion (Excluding Parramatta)

[Hughesy]

Daley is probably the most stereotypical politician I’ve ever seen. Blowing smoke up the ass of “everyday Australians” and hates anything other than “schools and hospitals”. All while waving his dick about trying to be this big tough guy “keeping the bastards honest”. This is early 2000’s Mark Latham-esque dillusion 😂

[GunnerWanderer]

1 hour ago, Prydzopolis said:

Watch old mate jonesy wage a personal war against him & ensure his life in politics is short lived. Ask Baird how turning down Jones demands worked out for him

Pretty good word is he’s about to get the CEO role at NAB 

pays just a little more than the average punter

i never follow politics but I **** love this guy for given to Alan johns for the first time I might vote for the stoners party 😂

[Davo]

1 hour ago, btron3000 said:

I’m gonna cherrypick now 

Except for the fact that they don’t need a new stadium over there and we do because we had members bulging at the seams and a stadium not big enough for us. Remember those good old days folks?

Anyway, agree with most of the rest of your post Mack.

And to cherrypick that cherrypick...

[SomeGuy1977]

16 hours ago, Prydzopolis said:

Watch old mate jonesy wage a personal war against him & ensure his life in politics is short lived. Ask Baird how turning down Jones demands worked out for him

Mike landed himself an exec job at NAB, where I reckon he's doing alright for himself (even with the highly charged focus on the banking industry). TBH, don't think he really give a ****

Edit: What @GunnerWanderer said

Edited March 6, 2019 by SomeGuy1977

[FCWanderers]

3 hours ago, SomeGuy1977 said:

Mike landed himself an exec job at NAB, where I reckon he's doing alright for himself (even with the highly charged focus on the banking industry). TBH, don't think he really give a ****

Edit: What @GunnerWanderer said

Speaking of Mike Baird, this article about how he handled the issue of Sydney stadiums is interesting in hindsight.

https://www.9news.com.au/national/2019/03/06/13/22/news-sydney-chris-okeefe-analysis-the-politics-of-allianz-stadium

[mack]

He got everything right except that pesky bit about not losing by-elections and having to jump before he was pushed.

And in breaking news the court has allowed the demolition to get underway.

Although I have no idea if it will or not now that the NSW Government is in caretaker mode.

[mack]

Allianz Stadium: demolition of Sydney arena gets green light

Demolition of Sydney’s Allianz Stadium will be able to resume after a judge dismissed a community challenge that sought to halt its dismantling before the March 23 NSW election.

Handing down her judgment this afternoon, Land and Environment Court Justice Nicola Pain found that the state government and Infrastructure NSW complied with environmental policies and state laws in the steps it took before beginning the demolition of the stadium in Sydney’s inner east, after challenges from group Local Democracy Matter and Waverley council to stop the stadium being demolished before the state election failed.

The decision comes after a temporary injunction came into place on February 27, that halted demolition work of the stadium’s roof and removal of other fixed structures while the court considered the challenge.

Chris Maltby, treasurer of Local Democracy Matters, previously said he believes the decision to ­redevelop the stadium seemed to have been made in “a great deal of haste” and was a “terrible waste of public money”.

It is the latest chapter in a long and troubled effort by the government to redevelop Sydney’s stadiums, following the government’s decision to downgrade a proposed rebuild of ANZ Stadium in Sydney’s west.

NSW Labor leader Michael Daley has been critical of the stadium demolition, with the party’s state election campaign set as “schools and hospitals before stadiums”.

Yesterday, Mr Daley’s clashed with broadcaster Alan Jones in a fiery radio interview, where he accused the SCG trust of “colluding” with the Berejiklian government to fund the costly stadium project.

He told Mr Jones, who is a member of the trust, that he would remove the entire board over its support of the demolition and rebuild.

“I don’t care what powerful figures are angry at me today,” Mr Daley said today. “I’m going to stick up for the people of NSW, who see this $730 million stadium deal as a big waste of money and a rip-off.”

The NSW Greens also oppose the plans.

At a December announcement that Lendlease had been awarded a contract to demolish the current stadium and construct a new one, NSW Sports Minister Stuart Ayres rejected calls from the NSW Opposition to wait until after the election to begin works at the Moore Park site.

“We are not going to stop and slow down building critical infrastructure because there’s an election around the corner,” he said.

In 2017 the state government announced plans to demolish and rebuild the Moore Park facility at a cost of $730 million.

In a 2015 letter to the Sydney Cricket and Sports Ground Trust, which administers Allianz Stadium, Mr Ayres said a $20 million government upgrade of the facility had put it “alongside the most technologically advanced sporting venues in the world”.

When announcing plans for its demolition two years later, Mr Ayres said the stadium had come to end of its life and was only “borderline safe”.

The 2017 stadiums announcement also included the demolition and rebuilding of Sydney’s Olympic Stadium, but the NSW Government downgraded those plans to a refurbishment of the stadium after public opposition.

[Prydzopolis]

Initial architect refutes assertion that current stadium is not safe.

[Wanderboy]

3 minutes ago, Prydzopolis said:

Initial architect refutes assertion that current stadium is not safe.

Of course he is going to say that. He designed the useless piece of shite.

[BoyFromTheWest]

It may be a kamikaze act for Daley to say it as it is to Jones but good on him.  I cannot really understand why anyone listens to Jones, let alone believes anything he says!  He has politicians in his pocket and they are too gutless to stand up to him, the ultimate abusive bully!  He is only matched by Murdoch - they are a pair.

As for Allianz, there is no way I can condone the government's action in spending huge dollars on a replacement.  An upgrade for sure.  What is actually unsafe about it?  Jones and his SCG Trust mates should foot the bill if they are so insistent.  Why does the public fund an East Sydney full replacement stadium in vicinity of $1,000,000 and  all of Western Sydney has one decent stadium, the biggest being our new one at 30,000. 

They could spend $2,000,000 on ANZ alone and it would not make it a better place to go. 

[Hughesy]

If Labor do come into power and decide not to re-build a demolished Allianz - watch the NRL threaten to move the GF interstate and they’ll cave instantly

[mack]

NRL already caved on that after the Libs backflipped on completely rebuilding ANZ.

[Prydzopolis]

2 hours ago, hughsey said:

If Labor do come into power and decide not to re-build a demolished Allianz - watch the NRL threaten to move the GF interstate and they’ll cave instantly

That’s what I thought Mack, the NRL were pushing for ANZ & required NRL to move games from ANZ to make the business case viable. It was union, Sydney FC & another sporting team that backed the Allianz project.

Now that this court appeal has been squashed, assume it’s all over now? Surprised Daley isn’t riding on the back of this move, trying another publicity stunt & putting in some sort of court challenge to stop the demolition?

[Hughesy]

9 hours ago, mack said:

NRL already caved on that after the Libs backflipped on completely rebuilding ANZ.

Didn’t they also write a letter or get behind some sort of lobbying for a rebuild of Allianz? Plus their headquarters are basically next door to Allianz. Still wouldn’t put it past them

[mack]

The Baird policy was to knock down & rebuild ANZ, and then refurbish the SFS. Then he banned Greyhound racing for a while before realising how much of a problem that was in the country, backflipped, which made people who were against it angry, and quit before he got dumped after the Nationals lost the Orange by-election. Which is an important reminder that no matter how good your policy is, if you don't stay in government it's irrelevant (see NBN).

In November 2017 Gladys announced that ANZ and the SFS would both be knocked down, with construction on the new SFS starting late 2018, and ANZ sometime in 2019.

After it become a toxic issue (it was announced at the same time as massive ongoing issues with the train timetable, and then was pounced upon by Fitzsimmons as a bete noire, because he wanted money for local clubs (which is usually a council issue but detail is irrelevant to a guy like Fitzsimmons) then was immediately turned into the current "NO ANYTHING BUT SCHOOLS AND HOSPITALS THE 40 BILLION A YEAR ISN'T ENOUGH" campaign.

The NRL's "Memorandum" with the NSW Government to keep the NRL Grand Final in Sydney for 25 years would have been voided if the Government didn't follow through with the plan to rebuild ANZ into a new Rectangular stadium.

But when Gladys backflipped on the ANZ Rebuild in March this year and watered it down to a $800 million refurbishment, the NRL went "eh, good enough" and dropped the issue.

[Flytox]

I read earlier this afternoon that if Allianz is too far gone Daley will have it replaced it with a smaller world class stadium.

[dcrow]

12 minutes ago, Flytox said:

I read earlier this afternoon that if Allianz is too far gone Daley will have it replaced it with a smaller world class stadium.

20k boutique would suit them and rooster well

[mack]

The 'easy' solution for a new Government would just be copy-paste in the WSS. They might also go back to Populous and ask them about their stadium bid which was an enlarged version of WSS.

[GD07]

Smaller stadium 🤔

That will make away derbies interesting, smaller allocation might mean we have to go to a derby with tickets decided by criteria. 

[mack]

I can't see it being under 30k.

[Wanderboy]

18 minutes ago, mack said:

I can't see it being under 30k.

Neither can I. The SCG members will see to that.

[Prydzopolis]

44 minutes ago, Wanderboy said:

Neither can I. The SCG trust will see to that.

Fixed

[Flytox]

1 hour ago, mack said:

The 'easy' solution for a new Government would just be copy-paste in the WSS. They might also go back to Populous and ask them about their stadium bid which was an enlarged version of WSS.

In normal circumstances the Government wouldn't own the design of WSS so they wouldn't have the right to copy and paste it.

[Paul01]

Update

Now in the NSW Supreme Court

Sydney stadium demolition on hold again after activists lodge appeal https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2019/mar/07/sydney-stadium-demolition-on-hold-again-after-activists-lodge-appeal?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Copy_to_clipboard

[Flytox]

A security expert's view on the lack of adequate egress at SFS.

https://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/opinion/the-old-sydney-football-stadium-is-a-disaster-waiting-to-happen/news-story/9b93847277157e58dddacaeda73fe8b3

Edited March 7, 2019 by Flytox

[Unlimited]

47 minutes ago, Flytox said:

A security expert's view on the lack of adequate egress at SFS.

https://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/opinion/the-old-sydney-football-stadium-is-a-disaster-waiting-to-happen/news-story/9b93847277157e58dddacaeda73fe8b3

Member only article

Lol ok won’t read it then

[wengerboy]

9 hours ago, Flytox said:

In normal circumstances the Government wouldn't own the design of WSS so they wouldn't have the right to copy and paste it.

That would make sense, Alianz is a stadium for Roosters, Waratahs, Sydney FC: clubs that arent huge and it isnt a event stadium anymore.  A 30k capacity stadium makes sense moving money for ANZ rebuilt.

[Davo]

They wouldn't be able to copy and paste it but surely they could do a deal. If they've already done the work the architects would be able to provide the design for a much lower cost. If they're going to charge them full price then there's no reason not to put it out to other architects and potentially give them no money.

[Carns]

Our first grand final against CCM showed the limitations of that stadium, the pre game crush trying to enter the venue could've been much more dangerous than it was.

[Flytox]

2 hours ago, Davo said:

They wouldn't be able to copy and paste it but surely they could do a deal. If they've already done the work the architects would be able to provide the design for a much lower cost. If they're going to charge them full price then there's no reason not to put it out to other architects and potentially give them no money.

Every site is different.  The SFS site is much tighter than the WSS site so the design has to be modified to suit the site. Foundation conditions are also different so the architectural program has to be modified to match the structural requirements of the site.  There is also the differences in the brief requirements of the different owners and hirers.  By the time they have done that the work in preparing the modified design is pretty much the same as doing a design from scratch.  The extra cost for the new SFS is a mix of the higher capacity stadium and demolishing and replacing the buildings that are in the way.  Even if they downsize  to WSS size it would still cost a lot more than WSS because of the site difficulties and extra work.

Its been a long time since I looked at the schedule of fees so someone may be more up to date than I am but I seem to recall a figure of 4% so if that's close then any savings in fees is neither here nor there.

Edited March 8, 2019 by Flytox