Armageddon Thread

[Midfielder]

1 hour ago, Stokz said:

We’re in week 11 of lockdown, with nearly 75% first dose, where is the official opening roadmap to prepare business?

What will be open at 70%, 80%, what will happen with the LGAs then? When will offices be back? What will the unvaxxed be able to do? 

Why is no asking one (journalists/opposition) for this ?

Why is it taking so long…..

Because the fear, danger, must be zero, ring, of steel gets hits and people to watch...

Bigger question for me is why is the pain of lockdowns so unevenly spread ... and not constantly reported on... why are the stories of people losing their houses, and the increase in depression and suicide almost never discussed.

Further why are some journalists so bias in their reporting...

IE

Those with ... Stand with Dan..say.... Kick Gladys out

Others.

Those with ... Sack Dan and Vic gov...say.... get behind Gladys plans..

 

AS an aside through a client who is a business insurance specialist... so he was speaking solely from a business perspective [note bias identified by all on the call]  ... anyWho I was in one of those [and its very new to me] phone link ups with 7 different people including me..... 3 of the 7 where in business in Melbourne.... they said they have been in lockdown so long many people in Vic especially younger people needing income are simply stepping outside the system and even if sick refuse to get tests.... to people in this group the hard authoritarian message has failed, they want ways out and hope... 

They i.e. the 3 Melbourne people, said ... thats why infection rate in NSW is 1.29 and in Vic is 2.1 I as no one seems to wanta discuss there is a point when lockdown are so hard and so long with little hope other than more of the same, some sections of the community effected, simply don't even try to comply.... which seems to support the softening of the Vic Health towards when they will open up..

[sonar]

You can open up, don't worry about how many die and let it rip and overwhelm the health system. Just as people will die, businesses will go broke. It's a ****ed sttuation and it didn't have to happen in NSW but because of the failures of the Libs....here we are.

[sonar]

6 minutes ago, sonar said:

You can open up, don't worry about how many die and let it rip and overwhelm the health system. Just as people will die, businesses will go broke. It's a ****ed sttuation and it didn't have to happen in NSW but because of the failures of the Libs....here we are.

https://au.news.yahoo.com/icu-nurses-send-open-letter-to-nsw-premier-we-cant-deliver-care-021104881.html

[Midfielder]

OK ... everything the Libs have done and said is wrong... and every thing the ALP has said and done is right...

Sounds very logical and very unbias..

If as many experts now thing that VIC numbers exceed NSW numbers it will all be the Libs fault... 

For me its kinda simple... there is a point when some people won't follow the lockdown rules and the testing requirements unless we ease up a tad and learn to live with cov.... IMO by far the greater risk of cov spreading is pushing these people underground so to speak.... 

As I said it was a small phone discussion of 7 people, 3 from Melbourne, and all in business... so all bias is declared ... and acknowledging the small sample size... 

However the rate of 1.29 V 2.1 is reported and according to those that prepare charts ... the 2.1 rate is not good and if it continues will see VIC with more daily cases than NSW... 

Meaning from where I stand, learning how to live with Cov is the critical thing moving forward and the key to that is vaccination raters ..

Clients work is banking up... so bye to next week all.... 

 

 

[Stokz]

But Sonar - I don't think most people aren't advocating for letting it rip and getting rid of all restrictions.

Surely there are some less risky (not zero risk) activities (particularly outdoors) that you could allow NOW that won't have much of an impact on cases. Especially since our target is no longer 0. But would have huge impacts for mental health. Things like picnics with 2 households (or groups of 5, not including kids), things like sport, 10km travel limits, regardless of vax status.

If you feel unsafe doing those activities - you can follow the current lockdown and wait till 80%, or maybe you can wait another 6mths till 90%.

My mum 59, was her birthday on Saturday, had a breakdown a few days before, saying shes missing us and the kids too much, she was crying her heart out. She said why should people have to sacrifice all this for me, when young kids are self harming or committing suicide, or families losing their business's, I lived my life a fair bit, let the kids/youngens have theirs. 

And guess I met up with my mum and dad on Saturday at the park after 10 weeks, and it was worth it. She loved every minute of it, and so did my kids.

[Stokz]

5 minutes ago, Midfielder said:

OK ... everything the Libs have done and said is wrong... and every thing the ALP has said and done is right...

Sounds very logical and very unbias..

If as many experts now thing that VIC numbers exceed NSW numbers it will all be the Libs fault... 

For me its kinda simple... there is a point when some people won't follow the lockdown rules and the testing requirements unless we ease up a tad and learn to live with cov.... IMO by far the greater risk of cov spreading is pushing these people underground so to speak.... 

As I said it was a small phone discussion of 7 people, 3 from Melbourne, and all in business... so all bias is declared ... and acknowledging the small sample size... 

However the rate of 1.29 V 2.1 is reported and according to those that prepare charts ... the 2.1 rate is not good and if it continues will see VIC with more daily cases than NSW... 

Meaning from where I stand, learning how to live with Cov is the critical thing moving forward and the key to that is vaccination raters ..

Clients work is banking up... so bye to next week all.... 

 

 

Victoria locked down harshly straight away. Goes to show maybe even if we did lockdown harder, it wouldn't have made much of a difference.

We can all the blame Gladys (I hate her), but it won't do us any good in getting us out of this mess. 

There's got to be solutions for the situation we are now in now.

[sonar]

15 minutes ago, Midfielder said:

OK ... everything the Libs have done and said is wrong... and every thing the ALP has said and done is right...

If as many experts now thing that VIC numbers exceed NSW numbers it will all be the Libs fault... 

 

 

Hmmmmm lets see.

Who had/has responsibility for our border........Morrison. 

Who had responsibility for hotel quarantine......Gladys.

Who let Delta into the country and who let it loose into the community when we were actually open and getting back to normal......Morrison and Gladys

Who let loose the Ruby Princess and the carnage that followed......... Morrison and Gladys....

What political party do they front....wel FMD it's the Libs for both of them.

So next time you have a phone get together you might want to point out we are where we are due to Liberal Party failures.

 

Edited September 7, 2021 by sonar

[sonar]

6 minutes ago, Stokz said:

But Sonar - I don't think most people aren't advocating for letting it rip and getting rid of all restrictions.

Surely there are some less risky (not zero risk) activities (particularly outdoors) that you could allow NOW that won't have much of an impact on cases. Especially since our target is no longer 0. But would have huge impacts for mental health. Things like picnics with 2 households (or groups of 5, not including kids), things like sport, 10km travel limits, regardless of vax status.

If you feel unsafe doing those activities - you can follow the current lockdown and wait till 80%, or maybe you can wait another 6mths till 90%.

My mum 59, was her birthday on Saturday, had a breakdown a few days before, saying shes missing us and the kids too much, she was crying her heart out. She said why should people have to sacrifice all this for me, when young kids are self harming or committing suicide, or families losing their business's, I lived my life a fair bit, let the kids/youngens have theirs. 

And guess I met up with my mum and dad on Saturday at the park after 10 weeks, and it was worth it. She loved every minute of it, and so did my kids.

I was being a tad sarcastic. I apologize.

The politicians have made this more than a health debate but a political one as well. 

My anger is directed towards those that allowed us to go from being open to a so far 11 week lockdown with no end apparent.

It should never ever have got to this.

 

[Unlimited]

Just gonna leave this here:

 

[Midfielder]

24 minutes ago, Stokz said:

Victoria locked down harshly straight away. Goes to show maybe even if we did lockdown harder, it wouldn't have made much of a difference.

We can all the blame Gladys (I hate her), but it won't do us any good in getting us out of this mess. 

There's got to be solutions for the situation we are now in now.

Got five minutes so quickly.

Agree, we can blame anyone, but its how they get you out once the mistake has been made.

Dan Andrews had mega numbers of mistakes early on, and those media on the right called for his head... but he got out of the mess with his lockdown so yeah mistakes were made but they did things to recover... so he needed to be supported and was for actions to recover...

Glady, made mistakes and she is now trying to get us out...

The question is not so much mistakes have been made, its how we get out... everyone is going to make mistakes.. in cities like Sydney & Melbourne ... 

This brings me back to the Melbourne phone call... the phone call I had yes small number and all in business... however what they said is some groups are sick and tied of the full om hard core messaging and have adopted out... and the VIC 2.1 & NSW 1.29 rates seem to support what they say.

Meaning the more softly, softly approach in NSW with small rewards at different points, SEEMS to talk more to the group of people adopting out better and which VIC is now copying... sorta like the management theory of manager X & manager Y... where the manager who trusted his staff, discussed things and accepted peoples word for most things achieved much greater productivity than the hard core full on manager that trusted no one and constantly watched what staff did.

Operating in a regional area where service industries provide many local jobs, you get to see real hardship because of lockdowns.

The biggest issue I have recently is how the burden of the lockdowns falls on certain groups with many other groups actually better off... 

Also assuming you could get Delta to zero in a major modern city is near impossible... 

Back to work and see you again in another week or so...

 

 

[sonar]

20 minutes ago, Midfielder said:

Got five minutes so quickly.

Agree, we can blame anyone, but its how they get you out once the mistake has been made.

Dan Andrews had mega numbers of mistakes early on, and those media on the right called for his head... but he got out of the mess with his lockdown so yeah mistakes were made but they did things to recover... so he needed to be supported and was for actions to recover...

Glady, made mistakes and she is now trying to get us out...

The question is not so much mistakes have been made, its how we get out... everyone is going to make mistakes.. in cities like Sydney & Melbourne ... 

This brings me back to the Melbourne phone call... the phone call I had yes small number and all in business... however what they said is some groups are sick and tied of the full om hard core messaging and have adopted out... and the VIC 2.1 & NSW 1.29 rates seem to support what they say.

Meaning the more softly, softly approach in NSW with small rewards at different points, SEEMS to talk more to the group of people adopting out better and which VIC is now copying... sorta like the management theory of manager X & manager Y... where the manager who trusted his staff, discussed things and accepted peoples word for most things achieved much greater productivity than the hard core full on manager that trusted no one and constantly watched what staff did.

Operating in a regional area where service industries provide many local jobs, you get to see real hardship because of lockdowns.

The biggest issue I have recently is how the burden of the lockdowns falls on certain groups with many other groups actually better off... 

Also assuming you could get Delta to zero in a major modern city is near impossible... 

Back to work and see you again in another week or so...

 

 

I love how you have continually named Dan Andrews and what a terrible job he did but you fail to mention that the deaths in aged care were....wait for it....a federal responsibility.  Also your line that the failure in hotel quarantine was a Vic ALP failure not a Federal one and Victoria should of been taking more people into quarantine not less although you seem to have had a road to Damascus conversion on that one once the Libs in NSW ****ed it.

The current Delta outbreak in Victoria is a direct result of Gladys and her early mockdown and Morrison thanking her not going harder which has allowed the virus to spread into Victoria and the regions. 

They own this lock,stock and barrel. It's on them.

Before Delta Vic AND NSW were OPEN. Now we're both ****ed.

Edited September 7, 2021 by sonar

[Paul01]

5 minutes ago, sonar said:

The current Delta outbreak in Victoria is a direct result of Gladys and her early mockdown and Morrison thanking her not going harder which has allowed the virus to spread into Victoria and the regions. 

They own this lock,stock and barrel. It's on them.

Before Delta Vic AND NSW were OPEN. Now we're both ****ed.

100% agree with you on this one.

For NSW

Morrison owns its 95%

Berejiklian 5%

[Midfielder]

Sums up the thoughts of some... 

Summer bush fires are expected because of the lack of rain in October thus the drying out of fuel in the bush...

Summer bushfires are expected because of the increased rain in October resulting in extra growth adding fuel to the bush.

Gotta get off this thread it does my head in... 

[Paul01]

1 minute ago, Midfielder said:

Sums up the thoughts of some... 

Summer bush fires are expected because of the lack of rain in October thus the drying out of fuel in the bush...

Summer bushfires are expected because of the increased rain in October resulting in extra growth adding fuel to the bush.

Gotta get off this thread it does my head in... 

Thread might go quiet around 10.00pm tonight for about 100 minutes or 2 halves of football and the half-time break with Vietnam v Australia 

[Paul01]

And "Dictator" Dan is getting really shirty with Morrison 

Victoria records 246 COVID cases as Daniel Andrews accuses Commonwealth of 'unfair' vaccine allocations https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-09-07/victoria-covid-cases-lockdown-vaccines/100439292

 

[sonar]

9 minutes ago, Paul01 said:

And "Dictator" Dan is getting really shirty with Morrison 

Victoria records 246 COVID cases as Daniel Andrews accuses Commonwealth of 'unfair' vaccine allocations https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-09-07/victoria-covid-cases-lockdown-vaccines/100439292

 

Yep...Criminal almost.

 

[Stokz]

For People who want a Vaccine Passport. You don't need one if:

You have Influenza
If you have AIDS
If you are Convicted Pedophile
Are a Convicted Felon
Have any other infectious Disease

Because privacy and discrimination.....

[Stokz]

4 minutes ago, sonar said:

Yep...Criminal almost.

 

As if you wouldn't give the biggest allocation to the state that is battling the worst outbreak.....

[sonar]

5 minutes ago, Stokz said:

As if you wouldn't give the biggest allocation to the state that is battling the worst outbreak.....

Then you also don't slag them off like Gladys did because they lag behind in vaccination numbers. Seriously, that was pathetic from her.

[sonar]

9 minutes ago, sonar said:

Then you also don't slag them off like Gladys did because they lag behind in vaccination numbers. Seriously, that was pathetic from her.

 

[Stokz]

32 minutes ago, sonar said:

Then you also don't slag them off like Gladys did because they lag behind in vaccination numbers. Seriously, that was pathetic from her.

She's ******* dumb 100%. Gold Standard Vaccination Program. (Yawn)

Scomo shouldn't criticize the other states either, when it's his fault, we are where we are.

And period all state premiers are playing childish games to be honest. Before this I wouldn't have known any other state premier other than Gladys. It's like they are all enjoying the power and their 5 mins of fame.

Australia has never felt more disconnected and apart. 

We are in this together - is the most bullshit statement post initial lockdown.

 

Edited September 7, 2021 by Stokz

[Davo]

4 hours ago, Stokz said:

For People who want a Vaccine Passport. You don't need one if:

You have Influenza
If you have AIDS
If you are Convicted Pedophile
Are a Convicted Felon
Have any other infectious Disease

Because privacy and discrimination.....

Don't pedophiles go on the sex offender registry and convicted criminals get a criminal record?

[mack]

15 minutes ago, Davo said:

Don't pedophiles go on the sex offender registry and convicted criminals get a criminal record?

I assume he means in the sense of not needing to tell people before you can enter an establishment.

Two of that list aren't highly infectious diseases, another isn't anything but hypothetical & un-specific, HIV/AIDS doesn't have the extreme transmissibility that COVID has.

Flu/Cold should be treated more seriously by society but would never require or demand COVID style requirements because usual flu/colds are a lot less deadly and less infectious than Covid. Business management will not tolerate having to turn away customers for illnesses that don't make their staff anywhere near as sick as Covid can, or where it's far less likely for customers to infect other customers. I also doubt the medical establishment would be on board in anyway with the testing & reporting requirements for generic flu & cold.

[Cynth]

 

[Cynth]

5 hours ago, Stokz said:

For People who want a Vaccine Passport. You don't need one if:

You have Influenza
If you have AIDS
If you are Convicted Pedophile
Are a Convicted Felon
Have any other infectious Disease

Because privacy and discrimination.....

You want pedophiles to have a vaccine passport? 

[Paul01]

Sobering 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/sep/07/western-sydney-could-see-724-deaths-but-thousands-saved-by-lockdown-modelling-shows?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other

[Paul01]

And with hospitals being at 100% capacity before Covid-19 times, when Emergency Departments were overrun, a new warning is sounded in the public arena

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2021/sep/08/doctors-warn-nsw-emergency-departments-face-five-times-the-number-of-covid-patients-as-icus?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other

So we have had the nurses come out publicly, the AMA and now Emergency Doctors to discuss the situation in NSW. This says to me that the NSW Health, for all the optimism put out by Berejiklian, is being run into the ground by dictatorial practices. 

So we have a corrupt NSW Premier  telling health professionals how to run the healthcare system. The NSW Premier was found to have misled the public on the rate of hospitalisations by only using admissions into NSW buildings but using the numbers in the Hospital In The Home program for National cabinet discussions last Friday. Plus Berejiklian refused to release the modelling she was briefed on 2 weeks till yesterday.

And, to quote John Cadogan again, we are living in the State of Afgladystan 

And her conservative colleague secretly gets more Pfizer vaccine into NSW to help the corrupt NSW Premier as well as trying to turn the tide of faltering to failing popularity. 

[wendybr]

Out of step with sentiments here...but the stats here do help keep things in perspective.

Yes yes...it's 2GB

https://fb.watch/7TfMj1Mj7O/

The focus of the global medical regulatory bodies, politicians and the media ( which is currently the promotional arm of the politicians) has always only been focused on vaccines, rather than exploring early treatments to prevent progression to the severe  stages of the disease...which occurs in 4-5% of people with the virus.

Vaccine policies alone seem not to prevent hospitalisation of the critically ill (see Israel until they started their perpetual 6 monthly booster strategy).

It's a shame that early treatment protocols, which may have prevented those hospitalisations, has never been any sort of priority...in Western countries at least.

Anyway...lots and lots if stats in the Ben Fordham item.

[marron]

I'm sure the market will provide a solution.

[wendybr]

Yeah...Pfizer's working on it...no doubt they all are.

It will be rolled out when everyone in the rich Western countries have been jabbed.

But probably no sooner.