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Are you downloading the Covidsafe app?  

26 members have voted

  1. 1. Will you be downloading the Covidsafe app?

    • Yes
      8
    • No
      15
    • Not sure yet
      3


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Just a quick poll to see who is and who isn't going to download the app.

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I did last night.

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It might be extreme but I now turning off Bluetooth on the mobile unless I am I  the car when I need hands-free. 

Not even a secondary handshake to someone else with the APP 

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Nope. Not me. I’ll stick to the social distancing and hygiene rules but I won’t  hand over data. 
 

I work  for a government agency and at first was horrified that I received an email today that they will be automatically putting the app on my work phone but then upon further reading, it is still voluntary to register for it. Phew. 
 

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6 minutes ago, Cynth said:

Nope. Not me. I’ll stick to the social distancing and hygiene rules but I won’t  hand over data. 
 

I work  for a government agency and at first was horrified that I received an email today that they will be automatically putting the app on my work phone but then upon further reading, it is still voluntary to register for it. Phew. 
 

we have handed over far more data to facebook than this, this provides valuable data about the interaction of the virus, its a bit of privacy I'll give up to help in the research of a deadly virus.

 

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9 hours ago, MartinTyler said:

Just a quick poll to see who is and who isn't going to download the app.

Done I've revealed far more about myself on here than the app will find out about me 

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I have downloaded and have no problem with this app. Anything we can do to get life back to normal is good. I don't mistrust this govt to do the wrong thing during these times.

I'm more ashamed and concerned that I was ever stupid enough to set up an account on ******* fb.

I wonder, if anyone refusing to download this app is on fb? Or Snap Chat. Or Instagram or Twitter? Or watch Tik Tok videos etc?

If you have, please tell me why downloading this app is worse.

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55 minutes ago, StringerBellend said:

we have handed over far more data to facebook than this, this provides valuable data about the interaction of the virus, its a bit of privacy I'll give up to help in the research of a deadly virus.

 

Yeah I know the arguments. :unknw:

56 minutes ago, Wanderboy said:

I have downloaded and have no problem with this app. Anything we can do to get life back to normal is good. I don't mistrust this govt to do the wrong thing during these times.

I'm more ashamed and concerned that I was ever stupid enough to set up an account on ******* fb.

I wonder, if anyone refusing to download this app is on fb? Or Snap Chat. Or Instagram or Twitter? Or watch Tik Tok videos etc?

If you have, please tell me why downloading this app is worse.

It’s not worse. I choose what I share on Facebook and Twitter. 
 

My argument stands that things we implement during this crisis that reduce our freedoms will not return completely afterwards. It’s bad enough that we have given police extra powers, if I can choose something small like not handing over my data to the government whilst still being a responsible citizen, I’m gonna take it. If I thought it was going to add a whole lot more to the current restrictions in place maybe I would download it but I am weighing the gain and I don’t see it. 

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1 hour ago, pseudonym said:

Personally I won't be downloading the app

Amazon doesn't treat its workers well in the US

And Amazon should have nothing to do with it when we have perfectly good Australian companies to manage the data. 

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1 minute ago, Cynth said:

And Amazon should have nothing to do with it when we have perfectly good Australian companies to manage the data. 

So why didn't the Australian Govt choose a perfectly good Australian company to do so? IYO?

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2 minutes ago, Wanderboy said:

So why didn't the Australian Govt choose a perfectly good Australian company to do so? IYO?

Yes this is my point....I don’t know. Amazon? Hmmmm....

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I bet there was a kickback in there somewhere. Why else would they? it's such a dumb thing to decide to do.

Amazon should not be anywhere near this thing. They are a despicable company. But neither should any US company, when legislation exists in that country which could essentially give over all of our data to the US government. What a joke.

Even aside from that, our government has a very poor track record with its handling of data. ANd like cynth said, I would have no choice in whatever it scoops up, unlike my careful and limited use of other apps. That's a bit part of it for me - that choice.

On top of this we have a government which is is increasingly trying to get over-reach into the monitoring of our lives, before all of this even. Yeah sure, I've not done anything i should be worried about (although hey, our governments aren't averse to retroactive law making, so there's that too). I don't want to make it easy for them though if it can be helped at this stage.

 

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1 hour ago, Wanderboy said:

So why didn't the Australian Govt choose a perfectly good Australian company to do so? IYO?

Here's why. US get the data under cover of national security then hand it over to Plod (Dutton)

Experts warn there are still legal ways the US could obtain COVIDSafe data http://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-04-28/covidsafe-tracing-app-data-may-not-be-protected-from-usa/12189372

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I don't use flybys or the Woolies card either, hardly use facebook less than a dozen ever, don't have twitter, do not have google global roaming on my phone, use cash for purchases when I can... I made a conscious decision many many many moons ago to make it difficult to analyse me.

But with this app, every person I know working in hospital's, at GP's surgery's, has down loaded the app... they feel it helps keep them safe... I think of bus drivers, taxi drivers,, shop assistance ...   i.e. people whose job it is to service the public.... two of my daughter's in law work in hospital's, one of my sons is a manager at a very large Woolworth's ... 

People in these jobs daily run the danger .... if teachers return they also from medical reports face dangers in the staff room and with parents picking up their children.

There is no argument, quick tracing helps stops the spread.

When I look at whats happened overseas and whats happened in Australia we along with a handful of countries have got it right.... in the political space only " Please Explain" & Joyce have come out against it both claiming privacy concerns... Personally I have never seen the Coalition, Labour , Greens & Independents  , work so well and essentially follow medical advise... as an aside on Q & A last night the had the second in charge doctor on the panel and it was refreshing to hear him speak... especially when he other people on the panel in there place.

 I morally feel I should do all I can to protect people taking risks like nurses, doctors, bus drivers, check out shop assistance's and so on.

When they put the legislation thu the parliament, and when they release the source code for IT folk to examine and assuming it gets the all clear... I am in...

Further its impossible to keep the lock down in place as people will start on mass to simply ignore .... we do have to prepare a way out and testing and tracing are seen as the best weapons available... 

For me its how confident I am about the security and if they can convince me of this then as I see it should be a must do.

 

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47 minutes ago, Paul01 said:

Here's why. US get the data under cover of national security then hand it over to Plod (Dutton)

Experts warn there are still legal ways the US could obtain COVIDSafe data http://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-04-28/covidsafe-tracing-app-data-may-not-be-protected-from-usa/12189372

OK its a great click bait .. may even be true .... but lets look at what it says... 

Global tech giant Amazon may not be able to protect Australian Government data held in its Australian servers — including data gathered by the COVID-19 tracing app released on Sunday — from US subpoenas, according to legal experts and crossbenchers.

The first thing that stands out is May but lets assume its possible.

the second point is """from US subpoenas""" meaning it first needs to get court approval and would be for one person .... 

Google have a history of fighting such things and to date I think have won ....

But secondly lets assume, its on a server based in the US, not Europe... lets assume it passes what is a complex court system to get at Google records, lets assume Google loose the court battle and are forced to hand data over to the US courts, where there are protections afforded to parties about privacy, assume these privacy US court polices break down... it would still be for one phone number or maybe more but it would be for a person of major interest...  yep it can happen but lots of things need to go well for it to break down and it would not be for the data base but for a single person or number.

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honestly i am not concerned about how they use the app during the outbreak, more concerned about what they do with it after its over

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10 hours ago, Cynth said:

Yes this is my point....I don’t know. Amazon? Hmmmm....

There probably isn't an Australian company eminently suitable !!

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11 hours ago, Cynth said:

And Amazon should have nothing to do with it when we have perfectly good Australian companies to manage the data. 

There really isn’t. To set something like this up at the scale needed, and in the time needed. Requires “cloud” compute at scale. Microsoft Azure or AWS are the logical choices.

anyone remember the mess they made of census. Which was IBM implementing the hosting. 
 

If you don’t go with cloud providers a just looked at datacentre, putting aside your struggle for the scale, youd mostly be looking at either US or Indian owned outsourcers

Hosting this stuff at scale is difficult (see also the recent Centrelink online fiasco)

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looking at the article and a bit of research, maybe a couple of the Australian cloud providers would be up to it. I’d still be concerned about scale, and reliability.

Anyone remember Optus and the World Cup? 
 

if it was my job on the line and I only had a few weeks to get it up and running, I’d be looking at companies that do this stuff all the time 

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17 minutes ago, StringerBellend said:

There really isn’t. To set something like this up at the scale needed, and in the time needed. Requires “cloud” compute at scale. Microsoft Azure or AWS are the logical choices.

anyone remember the mess they made of census. Which was IBM implementing the hosting. 
 

If you don’t go with cloud providers a just looked at datacentre, putting aside your struggle for the scale, youd mostly be looking at either US or Indian owned outsourcers

Hosting this stuff at scale is difficult (see also the recent Centrelink online fiasco)

Yeah, the company I used to work for were only considering those 2 for moving into the "cloud" for their IT systems.

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4 minutes ago, StringerBellend said:

looking at the article and a bit of research, maybe a couple of the Australian cloud providers would be up to it. I’d still be concerned about scale, and reliability.

Anyone remember Optus and the World Cup? 
 

if it was my job on the line and I only had a few weeks to get it up and running, I’d be looking at companies that do this stuff all the time 

Well if my Job was on the line and I needed the majority of people to feel comfortable enough to download it I would be making damn sure an Australian company and keeping data in our country was being explored first. 
Not instead limiting the tender to one company. :unknw:

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For a project like this that not only needs to provide a website / app at massive scale but also needs a data pipeline to feed the massive data to an analytics platform - all built within a month - the only three that come to mind are AWS, Azure and GCP.

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Downloaded app, anything to get his beast laid to rest and protect the front line, as for the third party data issues..........we face it everyday, i am naive enough to believe i am a good citizen and i have nothing to hide or fear.

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1 hour ago, Cynth said:

Well if my Job was on the line and I needed the majority of people to feel comfortable enough to download it I would be making damn sure an Australian company and keeping data in our country was being explored first. 
Not instead limiting the tender to one company. :unknw:

I'd be suprised if they could have only tendered to one company, having worked in govenment, procurement processes are quite strict in government.

AWS and Azure both have data centres in australia, and are hosting government, financial services, health data etc. already. So the data will be held in Australia, their levels of cyber security are extremely high (compared to smaller Data Centre hosting etc.)  

As @TheDugong  says if you have <1 month to stand it up and you need massive data and analytics at scale, and the not have the thing fall over and create a massive disaster, and most important ensure data secuirty (i.e. protect from Cyber attacks). The big Cloud Providers who do this stuff everyday are the ones to go with. Additionally I'd assume that other countries doing this have also used AWS to do it, therefore it would be duplicating what has already been done not doing it again from scratch.

I'd be more worried about my data, if the government tried to do this themselves or did it with a small provider

 

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Love them or hate them but Amazon and Microsoft will already have sufficient local staff with the correct government security clearances to manage this data.

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Ok you have convinced me that the big American guys are the only ones that can do the job. 
 

Excellent. 
 

For that reason, still not downloading it.
 

But I promise to use social distancing and hygiene and WFH practices and if I test positive I promise to tell the Health department everyone I’ve been in significant contact with because at this stage the list is small. Can I have pass please? :)

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