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  • Jets Down Wanderers In Newcastle

    mack

    By mack (edited)

    The Western Sydney Wanderers have been beaten by Newcastle Jets tonight as they suffered their 3rd A-league defeat in a row.

    Another controversial defeat, the Jets took advantage of lucky officiating to stay in the game until the second half where they opened the scoring in the 76th minute with a goalmouth scramble, and a 2nd late on from Dimi Petratos.

    Goalkeeper Daniel Lopar starred for the Wanderers, particularly in stopping the Jets strikers in multiple one-on-one situations. The first in the 15th minute was a right footed block against Jason Hoffman. Later on he used the opposite foot to deny Arroyo from an acute angle.

    Just like the week prior where the Wanderers were stuffed by a joke of a penalty call by an inept referee. Whereas last week they were punished by a non-penalty, this week they suffered from two obvious penalties in their favour being denied by Kurt Ams. Kwame Yeboah was clear through on goal when he was bought down from behind, Ams missed it completely, then ambled over for a VAR check that lasted about 2 seconds before denying the obvious penalty. Shortly after Nikolai Topor-Stanley should have given away another penalty for a stomp on the feet of the Wanderers attacker, but it was also waved away.

    The second half the Wanderers dominated the early stages, and were unlucky not to take the lead on the hour mark. Daniel Georgievski's short pass to Mitch Duke resulted in a first time right footed strike that Glenn Moss dove smartly for to deny, a follow up from Nicolai Muller was covered up once more by Moss and the last shot of the action was an acrobatic & inventive leaping kung-fu style front kick by Duke that blasted the ball over the top of the goal.

    Newcastle went in front in the 77th minute. After a dinked chip to the back post that was knocked down by a Jets attacker, Pirmin Schwegler stuck out a boot off-balance to prevent it reaching another Jets player only for it to fall to the feet of Angus Thurgate 3 yards from goal and he fired past Lopar. Newcastle sealed the game in the 85th minute, taking full advantage of Schwegler being kept off the pitch by the fourth official for a blood inspection despite him having already been cleaned up by the physio. After losing the ball in midfield, Newcastle dropped a long ball over the top of the stretched Wanderers defence, Thurgate timed his run well, drew Lopar out of goal and passed off to Dimi Petratos who tapped the ball into the open net.

    The Wanderers travel to Eden Park in New Zealand next week to face the Wellington Phoenix on Saturday December 7th.

    Edited by mack

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    THEWANDERERSPOST
    26 minutes ago, EmMac said:

    What i would be assessing if i was Babbel n co, is who or what is impeding the players in carrying out the game plan. Drill down to the issue

    Is he losing the dressing room?

    Link to comment
    DeeDee

    I think it's a mixed issue of underdone players, and players either being played out of position or not used to their strengths. Noteable instances are:

    - Dylan Mcgowan, is being asked to do alot of ball playing, more so then Jurman. Don't get it. On his day he is a fantastic stopper, keep his role simple.

    - Muller, Is a winger. Play him on the wing. Would much rather Duke in behind. He can physically be a pest in defence and can chime in and out with more impotence then Muller can. 

    - Schwegler, our most important player and dictator, has been a ghost in the last 2-3 matches. He should be a primary outlet. I did notice against the Jets he was lethargic though, did not demand and move for the ball like he should.

    - Geogevski, Not going to over react to one bad performance but you can see why as a right footer he prefers the left side. He loves to have both options. On the right he generally sticks to his right foot and his crosses hit the marker most of the time.

     

    On another note we have players who are proving wasteful in possession in vital areas, and in particularly dangerous areas where we are hit on the counter. The counter is something our midfield absolutely sucks at defending also. 

    - Duke, has been very wasteful of late, but somehow is always a goal threat. I say play him in the middle in behind the striker. Why? Muller has offered nothing there, and Duke won't exactly create there either but bring physical and defensive pressure so we can counter ourselves. He will be in around the box more and won't waste so many crossing chances.

    - Wilmering, the lad is young and a hard worker. But he is struggling to overlap and get decent deliveries in. I just think he should fine is craft a little more with the new found experiences and come back a better readier player.

    - Mcgowan, Not all his fault as stated above. Also the team has never offered a short ball option. 

    - Geogevski, see above. 

     The last issue is midfield. I am afraid to say whenever Baccus is on the park we get torn apart on the counter. Schwegler and co has not helped in the Jets game but Baccus get caught alot over committing to close down players and is ruined by one, twos. Sullivan needs to start and or Baccus used in a way where he won't get exploited so much. Don't get me wrong, Baccus plays with alot of energy and covers the pitch, just not effectively. 

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    beatsurrender

    Unfortunately the facts speak for themselves. Let’s look at the games so far. To be honest in the first game we won but could easily have lost. The Mariners matched us. We beat Vuck fair and square but for context they have had their worse ever start to a season.  We were lucky against the Smurfs, who once again are the best side in the league. Western United haven’t won since they beat us and Newcastle have also been pretty awful. So it’s not a good portent for two long away trips.

    Of course we have created chances but apart from a period against the two Melbourne teams have rarely dominated anybody. Most games could have gone either way depending on a bit of luck or a refereeing decision.  The Roar game was simply dire.

    I think we deserve better than this after the investment the club has made in players. No excuses now. Babbel has to produce this season or, quite rightly, the naysayers will move in. This team should not be short on confidence. How can a team that won their first 3 games be short on confidence but now after three straight defeats that could become an issue? I’m not sure either what ‘Mentality’ means other than a nice sound-bite.

    We are where we are and we have what we have personnel wise. Hopefully Muller and Meir especially can step up. The latter has been a major disappointment. He is in his late 30s. His legs may have gone. ☹

    The effort is there. They are trying. I keep coming back to the old chestnut about creativity. Without that we will always be a team who will win and lose in equal measure but never dominate anyone. We have no-one to recycle the ball, keep it ticking over and keep the pressure on. We rely on a worldie, a set-piece or a quick break. Watch the Smurfs and you can just see them scoring. They keep the foot on the throat and create numerous chances. You can see they are going to score eventually. You never get that feeling watching the Wanderers these days.

    Best we can hope for is top 4. More realistic is the top 6. That is a minimum for Babbel to keep his job although that still means it will be a frustrating and ultimately disappointing season. Of course once you are in play-offs everyone has a punchers chance. Let’s hope we start to gel sooner rather than later!

    Edited by beatsurrender
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    scarcev
    54 minutes ago, THEWANDERERSPOST said:

    Is he losing the dressing room?

    Wouldn't think so he bought half of them here.  Last I checked we are in 4th spot coming off a dodgy AF penalty which changed the game against a v v good City, we were very poor in one half yesterday and pretty good in the second and once again a dodgy AF penalty as well as poor finishing might of got us something, we have beat Victory in Melbourne and the only team to take a point (3) off Sydney who are flying.  We had some good luck when we won games early and noiw some bad luck when we have lost games we could of got something out of yet on here you would think we were rock bottom.

    Link to comment
    sonar
    14 minutes ago, scarcev said:

    Wouldn't think so he bought half of them here.  Last I checked we are in 4th spot coming off a dodgy AF penalty which changed the game against a v v good City, we were very poor in one half yesterday and pretty good in the second and once again a dodgy AF penalty as well as poor finishing might of got us something, we have beat Victory in Melbourne and the only team to take a point (3) off Sydney who are flying.  We had some good luck when we won games early and noiw some bad luck when we have lost games we could of got something out of yet on here you would think we were rock bottom.

    It's just fans expessing how they feel.  It's been the board/manager/players that have talked about how we will be one of the top side(s).....can't blame the fans for wanting better than what has been produced/promised. Rhetoric is fine but when it doesn't go to plan it looks like hubris or a load of BS..

    The club has talked the talk, time to walk the walk. 

    Edited by sonar
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    SBW
    1 hour ago, THEWANDERERSPOST said:

    Is he losing the dressing room?

    Doesn't look like it, the effort is there, you're not seeing players giving Babbel the cold shoulder ie Riera/Gombau

    Link to comment
    THEWANDERERSPOST
    22 minutes ago, SBW said:

    Doesn't look like it, the effort is there, you're not seeing players giving Babbel the cold shoulder ie Riera/Gombau

    Sure but I think its strange that the players personally chose to go against their managers tactics possibly because they thought better of them. I feel going against your manager is a bad sign.

    Edited by THEWANDERERSPOST
    Link to comment
    SBW
    7 minutes ago, THEWANDERERSPOST said:

    Sure but I think its strange that the players personally chose to go against their managers tactics possibly because they thought better of them. 

    Well no, I think in the first 15min of the first half, players were playing to the managers tactics, when Baccus missed the volley outside the box, the momentum of the game changed, Jets went on the counter and I think from there the whole game plan fell apart, the  players were doing their own things

    Link to comment
    Davo

    Sometimes it isn't the players actively trying to disobey the instructions of the manager. It could be that they lacked discipline, got lazy or struggled to implement the game plan against what the Jets were playing. None of those are good but they also don't mean the manager has lost the dressing room. Plus you only need a couple of players to do it and the whole system falls over, leading to the other players doing their own thing.

    Could also explain why they came out so much better in the second half as it would be an easy team talk to point out what they're doing wrong and reiterate the game plan.

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    THEWANDERERSPOST
    21 minutes ago, Davo said:

    Sometimes it isn't the players actively trying to disobey the instructions of the manager. It could be that they lacked discipline, got lazy or struggled to implement the game plan against what the Jets were playing. None of those are good but they also don't mean the manager has lost the dressing room. Plus you only need a couple of players to do it and the whole system falls over, leading to the other players doing their own thing.

    Could also explain why they came out so much better in the second half as it would be an easy team talk to point out what they're doing wrong and reiterate the game plan.

    Babbel stated he wanted hard working players. Is being lazy then considered going against the manager?

    Link to comment
    Davo
    43 minutes ago, THEWANDERERSPOST said:

    Babbel stated he wanted hard working players. Is being lazy then considered going against the manager?

    Not necessarily, it depends on the context.

    Meier was signed by the manager to score goals but it's not happening. That's not because he's going against the manager, he's just struggling to implement what the manager wants him to do. Same with a "lazy" payer that doesn't track a run when they're tired. It could be that they're doing it to defy the manager or they could just lack the, dare I say it, mentality to push through and make the run.

    The boss needs to get the players to implement when he wants, or drop them for someone who will, regardless of their motivations.

    Link to comment
    WanderingToqui

    From the Herald Sun by David Davutovic.

    MUSCAT TO WANDERERS?

    Former Melbourne Victory coach Kevin Muscat will be one of the names considered by Western Sydney Wanderers should the coaching position become vacant.

    German Markus Babbel is under growing pressure after a third straight loss and no wins since the famous – and fortuitous – Round 3 Sydney derby win.

    The Wanderers remain fourth, and while they had chances to beat Newcastle Jets, they’ve been wildly inconsistent under ex Liverpool defender Babbel.

     
     
    9787aca0754a96f7eb1f6751d23f03a7?width=1024

    Kevin Muscat acquired a decent trophy cabinet during his six seasons at Victory. Pic: Michael Klein.

    Matildas boss and former Wanderers assistant Ante Milicic is out of the running, as he will lead Macurthur Rams in their inaugural season of 2020-21.

    Muscat’s appointment would be too controversial for a host of A-League clubs, including Sydney FC and Adelaide United. But not the Wanderers.

    Muscat is currently in Europe watching games and searching for work. He has been flagged as an option for several Championship clubs, most recently interviewing for the job at his ex club Millwall.

    Link to comment
    THEWANDERERSPOST
    5 minutes ago, Davo said:

    So he's choosing between being chased by "several Championship clubs" or signing on to what would be our 5th manager in two and a bit seasons...

    He was mentioned in another thread, I suspect someone may be looking on here for content again.

    Link to comment
    BoyFromTheWest

    One of the most frustrating things in the first half for me (watching live at the game close to the fence, so don't always get the broader perspective you sometimes get on TV or further back) was Georgevski and Kamau.  Georgevski wants to bomb forward but seemed limited playing with a winger and Kamau is the most frustrating and difficult player for me to watch.  He does some good things and when he runs onto the ball, looks better.  I assume Babbel put a bomb under him at half time as he was better in the second half.  He stood still waiting for Georgevski (or McGowan) to pass and Koutrumbis beat him to every ball.  We kept going down the same side all the time and lost the ball every time.  What is the definition of insanity?  Doing the same dumb thing over and over hoping it will work next time!  That was us down the right side.

    ON the left, Wilmering defends well but isn't an attacking threat and cannot cross the ball.  Georgevski looked frustrated on the right and he and Kamau were playing in the same lanes most of the time (something that Pep G claims is a fatal error) and Duke had little real service on the right - is he a winger?  Really?  We were trying to go wide all the time (and slowly!!)  because we don't seem to be able to go down the middle.  There is a huge gap between the front line and Schwegler (not sure where the others are??).

    I find Kamau the most frustrating of the lot - when he is good he surprises me and does some great stuff but can be blown off the ball wit hthe slightest breath, let alone a half decent shoulder.  Just my frsutrated thoughts.

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    lloydy136
    1 hour ago, WanderingToqui said:

    From the Herald Sun by David Davutovic.

    MUSCAT TO WANDERERS?

    Former Melbourne Victory coach Kevin Muscat will be one of the names considered by Western Sydney Wanderers should the coaching position become vacant.

    German Markus Babbel is under growing pressure after a third straight loss and no wins since the famous – and fortuitous – Round 3 Sydney derby win.

    The Wanderers remain fourth, and while they had chances to beat Newcastle Jets, they’ve been wildly inconsistent under ex Liverpool defender Babbel.

     
     
    9787aca0754a96f7eb1f6751d23f03a7?width=1024

    Kevin Muscat acquired a decent trophy cabinet during his six seasons at Victory. Pic: Michael Klein.

    Matildas boss and former Wanderers assistant Ante Milicic is out of the running, as he will lead Macurthur Rams in their inaugural season of 2020-21.

    Muscat’s appointment would be too controversial for a host of A-League clubs, including Sydney FC and Adelaide United. But not the Wanderers.

    Muscat is currently in Europe watching games and searching for work. He has been flagged as an option for several Championship clubs, most recently interviewing for the job at his ex club Millwall.

    We could do a lot worse......

    Link to comment
    Smoggy
    4 minutes ago, lloydy136 said:

    We could do a lot worse......

    :nono:

    Got to stick with Babbel for this season...his team now and no excuses, pressure on.

    We cannot afford to have a **** season. We are going to see home attendances dip below 10k if this keeps up, that would be a disaster at a time looking to capitalize on new ground and being home at Parra. 

    Edited by Smoggy
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    Upthehill
    3 minutes ago, pseudonym said:

    not opposed to Muscat at WSW but it seems too soon

    If we're asking questions of the club, the main one should be about medical staff and how we manage injuries

    Doesn’t seem too soon to me. How many wins has Babbel got under his in his tenure? 6? 7? All 3 of those this season were far from convincing.

    He’s made odd recruitment choices, and is persisting using players out of place. Add that to the fact he can’t keep players fit...

    On the flip side, He’s been ****ed VAR 2 weeks in a row.

    Im not saying I personally want him gone but you can see how people might be starting to lose patience with him with our season essentially in free fall.

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    pseudonym
    33 minutes ago, Upthehill said:

    Im not saying I personally want him gone but you can see how people might be starting to lose patience with him with our season essentially in free fall.

    Yeah definitely seeing the frustration 

    I see that having arisen from the club admin rather than solely Babbel

    Coming back to Parramatta and the announcement of MacArthur FC was always going to have insane pressure placed on the team to get silverware

    If we had had comfortable 4th/5th placement in our Spotless/ANZ years, this team's performance might be seen in a different light

    Link to comment
    sonar
    1 hour ago, StringerBellend said:

    We did a lot worse we had Gumby

    Babbels was worse last season.....with basically the same squad. Whose fault was that...Gumby...? As was told by many the manager owns the results.

    Edited by sonar
    Link to comment
    GunnerWanderer

    Seriously give me a **** break are these journos so short of stories they start this rubbish. Fair enough people can rant on here but it sounds like nothing but Wanderers bashing from DD. 

    yes muscat would be an option but to even say Babbel is close to getting the chop is incredibly naive imo. 

    it just ends up another wasted season and then seeing a new coach bring in his players which takes a minimum of 18 months in this league with the cap. 

    if in another 4 weeks we are dire than publish your **** but the league is full of inconsistent teams - city and east Sydney  aside... babbel needs to figure this **** out without speculation about his job already

    The players need to see this **** and step up 2 away games will provide some good bonding time hopefully some hard truths are spoken and they return back to wanderland hungry as hell to win back some love from the fans. 

    Link to comment
    Upthehill
    31 minutes ago, sonar said:

    Babbels was worse last season.....with basically the same squad. Whose fault was that...Gumby...? As was told by many the manager owns the results.

    Lots of those points came to us at the start of the season under Fox from memory. Gumby arguably had a worse squad though.

    Id suggest in this scenario part of the problem is Babbel having a football brain, having coached tier 1 footballers and having coached in tier 1 leagues that he’s struggling with guys who just aren’t quite up to it.

    What you get with guys like Ange, Popa, Musky and Arnold is a strong knowledge of the local players. Saying “you’re all ****, were using the academy players” is a proven formula for failure in Australia.

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