Cup Calamity At Blacktown

[marron]

2 hours ago, Smoggy said:

Will have to consult my blue mountains walks book.

https://www.nationalparks.nsw.gov.au/visit-a-park/parks/blue-mountains-national-park/local-alerts

#rudanout

[StringerBellend]

The sqaud is crap but MR job as any coach is to make it play as a team and be better than the sum of its parts. It isn't he's failing..was weird that we have him long term gig based on some ok results and a bit of improvement. Since then I can't tell the difference between MR and CR version WSW 

 

[MathyouWSW]

43 minutes ago, StringerBellend said:

The sqaud is crap but MR job as any coach is to make it play as a team and be better than the sum of its parts. It isn't he's failing..was weird that we have him long term gig based on some ok results and a bit of improvement. Since then I can't tell the difference between MR and CR version WSW 

 

CR's version would of consisted of having Ibini, Petratos, Troisi and Ogawa being selected in the starting XI each week as the front 4 even if they had zero shots on target or were on a scoreless drought which pretty much happened. Robinson wouldn't even barge to try a different tactic at all. 

At least Rudan tried different tactics. MR's version was he removed Ibini entirely, Petratos and Ogawa were eventually moved on the bench, he relied on Lopane to provide goals upfront, he gave an opportunity to a 23 year old with little experience in the A-League and after witnessing two games, it has many of questioning "why the f*ck hasn't Carluccio been giving more game time throughout his career?". Plus, Rudan gave Cancar an opportunity as well. Unlike Robinson, he went and signed him and practically had him in the NPL Wanderers squad which is way above his class.

[102megan]

At least Robinson was never accused of "allegations".

Didn't realise it would be that difficult for the club to have morals, and to find someone as a coach who can:  1) Actually Coach.  2) Be a decent human being. 3) Respect women and treats them as people and not just objects. 

[pseudonym]

Not difficult, just less convenient than ringing up a "mate" on the golf course

Club: "You mean I have to read job applications?" 

[OntheFence]

2 hours ago, WHACKO said:

 SIMPLES!!!

It is simple, get it right.

The practice in getting it wrong has been great experience, just got to do the opposite of whats been happening for last 6 years.

[OntheFence]

2 hours ago, StringerBellend said:

The sqaud is crap

The old squad that CarloCrapobinson built, proved to be sub A league and CUP standard(this year and next years cups)

The squad being built, is yet to be known.So there isnt a crap squad.The players leaving will be announced very soon.

Gradually the players joining will be known.

One is known and he has plenty of experience,hes a hands on sort of guy.

Edited May 14, 2022 by OntheFence

[OntheFence]

48 minutes ago, 102megan said:

1) Actually Coach. 

His record isnt bad, 3 and a half seasons in A league and qualified for top 6 twice.

Success at NPL level.

Anyone who singles out MR as the cause of this past season should have a reality check.

This time next year he is fair game if the results are poor.

4/ took on the most difficult task of any coach THIS year.Trying to turn poor players into good ones to satisfy dreamers.

[marron]

I didn't want to see poor players be turned into good ones (although it was funny how at the beginning of the season there was a LOT of talk about how we had a good looking squad; weird how players come here and then just kinda give up). I didn't expect success. It was a very difficult job. (possibly not the hardest though). But what I wanted was to see poor players play like it meant something. I wanted to see the end of the back passing, and have them give it a go - not just in patches, but consistently. I'm happy to concede there was a little bit of improvement up front at times. That's too low a bar.  I wanted to see some fire in the belly, but he chose Troisi as his captain lol. I wanted to see him going, this is the ****in a-league, we can't expect to sign an entirely new squad, so let's see who is going to be worth retaining and motivate them to show us why they should hang around. Not - oh, in 6 months I'll sort it out. Of course, maybe he wouldn't have had that attitude - sort it out later - if he didn't know he was going to be here and had something to prove himself. Instead he's flipping off wellington fans and giving up.

I look forward to those ten awesome players he is going to sign that nobody else wants (because there's no way we get players if some other club wants them, because that's not how WSW operates).

[GD07]

Good warm up for next season. Let’s just play home games at rooty hill, there’s enough capacity for how we’re going. 

[MathyouWSW]

1 hour ago, 102megan said:

At least Robinson was never accused of "allegations".

Didn't realise it would be that difficult for the club to have morals, and to find someone as a coach who can:  1) Actually Coach.  2) Be a decent human being. 3) Respect women and treats them as people and not just objects. 

 

Pretty sure my previous post I was referring to Rudan's managing skills and not how he manages his personal life. 

Since day one when the club announced that Rudan was appointed head coach of the Wanderers, I think you've continuously mentioned Rudan's "allegations" like a broken record. I'm not sticking up for Rudan, I've never met the guy (and probably never will) and I don't know him on a personal level. But honestly, what was the outcome of the allegations? Seems like absolutely nothing was the result and it happened roughly 5 years ago. Time to move on.

If Rudan was found to have been 'stalking' a female, I'm guaranteed that any A-League club or any NPL club WOULD NOT have him appointed to manage their club and he'll most likely be vanished with football for good.

Can Rudan coach? Yes.
- He managed Sydney United to win the National Premier League Championship in 2013 (against South Hobart) and in 2016 (against Edgeworth) 
- He managed Western United into the Semi-Finals in their inaugural season in the A-League. That alone I say is a great achievement
- He managed Wellington Phoenix into the finals when he was appointed with them and it was their first time in four years.

I say based on this, the club decided he was good enough to be appointed the manager for the Wanderers. 

Also, aren't we forgetting that Robinson had 'allegations' of providing a toxic environment towards within club? or are we just going to completely ignore that now? If I recall, the news broke out in December 2021 that Robinson had a toxic environment within the club. A month later, he was told his services were no longer required. 

Edited May 14, 2022 by MathyouWSW

[marron]

You are kidding yourself if you think the club wouldn't have hired him if he'd done something but it wasn't proven 

1 hour ago, MathyouWSW said:

I say based on this, the club decided he was good enough to be appointed the manager for the Wanderers. 

 

I think that sums up the larger issue; it's not that the club don't think there's anything wrong, it's that they don't care or arent interested- which is exactly the problem if you zoom back and look at wider society. 

Toxicity wasn't levelled at Robinson, as much as he was useless. It was levelled at the organisation. Aside from any personal stuff and whatever happened there, Rudan has had that levelled at him at his former a league clubs. If we've got a cultural issue - which we do, aside from any online accusations or rumours just look at what happens players who come here, and look at the broken state of fan relations- hiring the bloke with issues and then giving him MORE control is just stupid. 

[OntheFence]

1 hour ago, marron said:

I look forward to those ten awesome players he is going to sign that nobody else wants

I mentioned "good"...by good I mean of a quality(if fit) they are in contention to be selected to start.

Awesome players are in England Spain Italy Germany,they aint signing with Wanderers.

[marron]

1 minute ago, OntheFence said:

I mentioned "good"...by good I mean of a quality(if fit) they are in contention to be selected to start.

Awesome players are in England Spain Italy Germany,they aint signing with Wanderers.

And I meant good for the league, which would be awesome for us.

[OntheFence]

1 hour ago, MathyouWSW said:

Can Rudan coach? Yes.
- He managed Sydney United to win the National Premier League Championship in 2013 (against South Hobart) and in 2016 (against Edgeworth) 
- He managed Western United into the Semi-Finals in their inaugural season in the A-League. That alone I say is a great achievement
- He managed Wellington Phoenix into the finals when he was appointed with them and it was their first time in four years.

I say based on this, the club decided he was good enough to be appointed the manager for the Wanderers. 

He has enough experience to do well with players that fit his style and are COACHABLE.Thats an important factor, there have been big name$$$ that have come to the A league and contributed not much.

We all hope that the 5 Imports are good enough to start every game, paying the $$$ justifies expecting a crertain level of performance.The season is over, its been highly disappointing for all involved I'm sure.

[OntheFence]

1 hour ago, MathyouWSW said:

Also, aren't we forgetting that Robinson had 'allegations' of providing a toxic environment towards within club?

He was also on the nose with the Canadian club.

[OntheFence]

5 minutes ago, marron said:

which would be awesome for us.

Making the 6 would be awesome too!

[GE942150]

2 minutes ago, OntheFence said:

He was also on the nose with the Canadian club.

Where's our Canadian friend who warned us? 

[WHACKO]

5 minutes ago, OntheFence said:

He was also on the nose with the Canadian club.

So similar to Rudan at Western. 

[OntheFence]

17 minutes ago, GE942150 said:

Where's our Canadian friend who warned us? 

Canada

[OntheFence]

15 minutes ago, WHACKO said:

So similar to Rudan at Western.

We probably won't know the full story.

I do recall MR in a little dispute with Wellington about moving his family to NZ,both parties didn't come to terms so MR took the WU job.He did well in the first year and was doing well until the run of losses.What was behind the run of losses only the insiders know.

He has THE JOB at WSW now.I live in hope he can bring in some quality that can finish and generally lifts the performance levels up above bottom 6 standard.

[WHACKO]

34 minutes ago, OntheFence said:

We probably won't know the full story.

I do recall MR in a little dispute with Wellington about moving his family to NZ,both parties didn't come to terms so MR took the WU job.He did well in the first year and was doing well until the run of losses.What was behind the run of losses only the insiders know.

He has THE JOB at WSW now.I live in hope he can bring in some quality that can finish and generally lifts the performance levels up above bottom 6 standard.

Don't get me wrong I want the same as you do...we get quality players in and we challenge for titles. 

For me though we need more than hope. Based on what I've seen Rudan is not the man for the job.

That's just my opinion and I'll leave it there.

[marron]

57 minutes ago, OntheFence said:

He has enough experience to do well with players that fit his style and are COACHABLE.Thats an important factor, there have been big name$$$ that have come to the A league and contributed not much.

 

Players don't make the a-league unless they are coachable to a degree. Robinson put together a decent squad on paper and couldn't coach them. Rudan hasn't coached them well either. But players don't make it that far without being worked with to improve their game and being able to adapt to at least a couple of management styles.  I get they are not his but we are (and he is) in a fantasy land if in the a-league you put together all your "own". You have to make do to a certain degree, always. Aside from that though either they are both not able to coach players or there's something else rotten (Or both to varying degrees). Or in Rudans case he doesn't want to bother with them which I find worrying.

[GunnerWanderer]

3 hours ago, MathyouWSW said:

 

Pretty sure my previous post I was referring to Rudan's managing skills and not how he manages his personal life. 

Since day one when the club announced that Rudan was appointed head coach of the Wanderers, I think you've continuously mentioned Rudan's "allegations" like a broken record. I'm not sticking up for Rudan, I've never met the guy (and probably never will) and I don't know him on a personal level. But honestly, what was the outcome of the allegations? Seems like absolutely nothing was the result and it happened roughly 5 years ago. Time to move on.

If Rudan was found to have been 'stalking' a female, I'm guaranteed that any A-League club or any NPL club WOULD NOT have him appointed to manage their club and he'll most likely be vanished with football for good.

Can Rudan coach? Yes.
- He managed Sydney United to win the National Premier League Championship in 2013 (against South Hobart) and in 2016 (against Edgeworth) 
- He managed Western United into the Semi-Finals in their inaugural season in the A-League. That alone I say is a great achievement
- He managed Wellington Phoenix into the finals when he was appointed with them and it was their first time in four years.

I say based on this, the club decided he was good enough to be appointed the manager for the Wanderers. 

Also, aren't we forgetting that Robinson had 'allegations' of providing a toxic environment towards within club? or are we just going to completely ignore that now? If I recall, the news broke out in December 2021 that Robinson had a toxic environment within the club. A month later, he was told his services were no longer required. 

Toxic environment is one thing I think the stuff against Rudan is another non football matter.

In saying that, 3 clubs have employed rudan since the so called allegations surfaced.

If the allegations were that bad, one is basically alleging themselves that the management and hierarchy of 3 professional clubs turned a blind eye to so called allegations. 

If that’s your stance I suggest you send a letter to FA chief voicing your displeasure against the A-league is a whole. 

Perhaps certain individuals have more factual info than the authoritatives had when investigating the whole thing I don’t know. 
 

I’d rather have rudan than Robinson 🙂

[marron]

There's the personal issue, but there's also his general management style which at Phoenix and at Western both ended with accusations of toxicity.

Clubs are welcome to make decisions. On the former, nothing ever resulted from it, it's rumours alone. Fine (not fine, actually, but a separate issue, relating to why big organisations are often happy to keep employing or re-employing people in positions of power who do shitty things. But anyway.). On the other stuff - which relates directly to his specific job and how he does it -  imo he is not the guy you get if you have issues at your own club of a similar nature. Sometimes personalities clash. Fine There's always two sides. Fine. But he's had it twice. We've been having it under the surface for 5 or 6 years. It's dumb to get in someone like this.

There is more to a football club than it's first team. And if they want to make the first team manager the figurehead of the whole thing, okay (not really okay, actually, but whatever), but that figurehead is now a statement about what your whole club is. Our football club is "we're desperate, who's unemployed right now? you got his number?" Our football club is "I don't care, just get him in. You know what, he's not had any time to show he's able to get a bunch of players interested yet but **** IT let's give him a contract". Our football club is "the concerns of our community is outside noise".  And our football club is "eh, just give up, can't be ****ed". And "actually one thing I will expend energy on is riling up opposition fans".

 

[Wanderboy]

The most successful clubs on the whole are those with some stability, season in and season out. Dare I say it, this is something the arseholes from the East have had continually.

This is something we haven't had since Popovic pulled the pin at the last minute before the 16/17 season.

Continual turnover of players, continual turnover of managers.

How does this approach garner a club culture, when nobody knows if they will be here for more than a season?

I don't know how he managed to do it, but even with Popa's "cleanouts" he still managed to keep a certain culture of success.

It blows my mind that we haven't been able to maintain that. And surely, the failure for that comes down to the reactionary decisions of senior management?

Last night was not quite, but almost, the lowest ebb following the Wanderers.

Strangely enough, I still wore my Wanderers cap and season jersey to my daughters netball game today at Kellyville. Maybe I've lost the plot as well. Yet, I call that stability.

Edited May 14, 2022 by Wanderboy

[GunnerWanderer]

I remember clearly at the nix everyone loved rudan and it wasn’t until he left did the stories came out for me that says a lot. 
 

WU they just collapsed and both parties seems happy to part there was the accusations that rudan made someone clear his skid marked undies not much came of that either - I think the bigger issue here is if rudan still can’t wipe his arse he might need to seek help haha 

so yeah I am not sure how much much truth there is to the toxic claims I guess we will find out next season! 

[Westiesarebesties]

6 hours ago, MathyouWSW said:

 

Pretty sure my previous post I was referring to Rudan's managing skills and not how he manages his personal life. 

Since day one when the club announced that Rudan was appointed head coach of the Wanderers, I think you've continuously mentioned Rudan's "allegations" like a broken record. I'm not sticking up for Rudan, I've never met the guy (and probably never will) and I don't know him on a personal level. But honestly, what was the outcome of the allegations? Seems like absolutely nothing was the result and it happened roughly 5 years ago. Time to move on.

If Rudan was found to have been 'stalking' a female, I'm guaranteed that any A-League club or any NPL club WOULD NOT have him appointed to manage their club and he'll most likely be vanished with football for good.

Can Rudan coach? Yes.
- He managed Sydney United to win the National Premier League Championship in 2013 (against South Hobart) and in 2016 (against Edgeworth) 
- He managed Western United into the Semi-Finals in their inaugural season in the A-League. That alone I say is a great achievement
- He managed Wellington Phoenix into the finals when he was appointed with them and it was their first time in four years.

I say based on this, the club decided he was good enough to be appointed the manager for the Wanderers. 

Also, aren't we forgetting that Robinson had 'allegations' of providing a toxic environment towards within club? or are we just going to completely ignore that now? If I recall, the news broke out in December 2021 that Robinson had a toxic environment within the club. A month later, he was told his services were no longer required. 

Lol, insane you’ve got people still willing to back someone who has clearly had his indiscretions swept under the rug…

[Westiesarebesties]

2 hours ago, marron said:

There's the personal issue, but there's also his general management style which at Phoenix and at Western both ended with accusations of toxicity.

Clubs are welcome to make decisions. On the former, nothing ever resulted from it, it's rumours alone. Fine (not fine, actually, but a separate issue, relating to why big organisations are often happy to keep employing or re-employing people in positions of power who do shitty things. But anyway.). On the other stuff - which relates directly to his specific job and how he does it -  imo he is not the guy you get if you have issues at your own club of a similar nature. Sometimes personalities clash. Fine There's always two sides. Fine. But he's had it twice. We've been having it under the surface for 5 or 6 years. It's dumb to get in someone like this.

There is more to a football club than it's first team. And if they want to make the first team manager the figurehead of the whole thing, okay (not really okay, actually, but whatever), but that figurehead is now a statement about what your whole club is. Our football club is "we're desperate, who's unemployed right now? you got his number?" Our football club is "I don't care, just get him in. You know what, he's not had any time to show he's able to get a bunch of players interested yet but **** IT let's give him a contract". Our football club is "the concerns of our community is outside noise".  And our football club is "eh, just give up, can't be ****ed". And "actually one thing I will expend energy on is riling up opposition fans".

 

It’s insane that such a serious accusation was never properly addressed. 
 

Then you’ve got fake Twitter account, the bad blood at previous clubs.

Clearly the management doesn’t care, but it’s hard for me to justify going to games with him there. I know a few people who’ve pulled their membership as a result and won’t be back till he’s gone.

[Legionista]

To address an accusation you need an accuser and an actual accusation.

It’s all a bit unclear as it stands now.